Building views / visibility settings

Materials should control as this is more like dealing with a real building in Space. Levels and sometimes symbology by levels is only a drafting approach. Objects would only be visible through the material if it is glass or some transparent aluminum (Star Trek)
Or if you needed to modify the material to be transparent for a need to show things beyond for a drafting need.

The representation is more real.

Material definitions for rendering is usually not what building engineers are out after. Drawing extractions didn't do that job either.

I am definitely with Andreas - materials are for rendering.

And if I understand correctly this is an old issue.

And transparency from element, level or reference should not influence what is included in a BV.
A test is glass in windows - they should be transparent in renderings, 3d-pdfs etc - but NOT in facades.

Some properties of a Building Views is set in chosen Display Style. And if you select FORWARD DRAWING there is a property TRANSPARENCY TRESHOLD - I think it should be OFF in BVs!

But when I put glass in front of a hallway - I would draw what is behind very lightly in some cases. That is not rendering any longer.
It is drafting,

As Eric mentioned there are cases where one may want "transparency" in Drawings, which is what the default system provides.

But as Thomas mentions this can be controlled via the Transparency Threshold slider per Display Style. So for something like Forward-Drawing perhaps that threshold slider can be increased or turned off (as I know Thomas prefers :-)).

That's ok, but what I thought was that the transparency threshold was referring to the level (or object) transparency, not the material transparency.

I believe this is because the Family + Part system by default overrides base MicroStation functionality in this case, using the Part material assignment's opacity value against the Transparency Threshold slider value to determine whether an element will display as transparent (and to what degree). If an element has no Part or material assigned, the Transparency Threshold value should only compare against the element's "native" transparency value since there is nothing else to control it.

I believe this is because the Family + Part system by default overrides base MicroStation functionality in this case, using the Part material assignment's opacity value against the Transparency Threshold slider value to determine whether an element will display as transparent (and to what degree). If an element has no Part or material assigned, the Transparency Threshold value should only compare against the element's "native" transparency value since there is nothing else to control it.

It was a while since I dealt with this.

But DEM>FORWARD and! REFLECTED tabs has ENABLE TRANSLUCENT MATERIALS which looks at assigned material (by part only or perhaps also by level etc?) and allows you to show contours behind a glass rail, and even override the contours symbology.

So you could assign different material to glass in windows in a facade than in a railing. A high, and well balanced, level of control if you ask me.

But BVs looks at element+level+ref transparency - and I think that is bad as you apply transparency that way of very different reasons than how it will look in a cut. At least I only use those transparency controls to see better in 3d-mode, 3d-pdfs etc.

My assumption is that those who constructed Dynamic Views never cared to study DEM, or understood it, before they raced away with DVs - and here we are.

I've done some more tests now, but I am very unsure about the results.

I am doing the tests with the .757 build, contrary to when I filed the SR, when I was using the .747. Don't know if that has anything to say, though.

I can't reproduce my first finding anymore, that changing the material of a slab to glass, makes the objects behind shine through in a forward view.

The only thing that makes them shine through is setting the level transparency above the value for the transparency threshold.

That's how it should be.

Some bugfixes done in the .757 build probably?

Yes, that's exactly what you should be seeing! The Threshold and Material values should work in conjunction with each other. Whether that's a change in later builds I honestly don't know (or remember) but I'm glad it's not working this way for you.

It's not the same as DEM, as Thomas noted, but DVs are a different animal in many respects being live geometry and not specific to Building but available to all disciplines (including base MicroStation).

I think the Transparency Threshold should be turned OFF by default in all Display Styles used for drawings (sheets in Bentley speak).

Hi Thomas,
The request to have the Transparency Threshold slider disabled as you've described was logged as Enhancement # 19624.