Is Bentley Missing a Trick?

Although my Architectural training was Pre-CAD Days, by the time I went back to do a Masters in Computing and Design it was possible as a student to gain access to free Bentley Microstation Software at the university.  It was also possible to Purchase a student Licence at a knock down price which gave you full access to the software features. I guess the Bentley establishment trusted that you wouldn’t go on to start your own practice and continue using the software for commercial purposes.  By the time I moved to a Practice that used Bentley Microstation I was considered a Guru in the office, the Go to Person.

I find that these days however students are graduating from university fully trained up on Rhino and Grasshopper and have never even heard of Bentley / Microstation / AECOsim ????

In some cases where there are projects requiring the use of Bentley they must completely retrain to get up to speed.

It seems that Bentleys policy on catching the younger generation of professionals has slipped and (as is the case where I work) practices are gradually shifting onto various other bits of software by other vendors because they simply cannot meet the demand for fully trained staff to man the projects using Bentley products.

Parents
  • That's fine, BUT !!, 

    Does Bentley expend the extra effort to "Globally" promote the use of its Products at student level, especially where there are easier to learn and simpler to use bits of software out there these days and more so where the product range seems to be becoming increaingly diversified and not really centered on any core. 

    I assume also that students do not have access to the pricey Bentley learn server.   

    The new generation of professionals are graduating with skills in Sketch up, Rhino, and God knows what else, a good majority with Revit which seems to be a more popular choice at the upper level.

  • especially where there are easier to learn and simpler to use bits of software out there these days

    Yes, Mstn + Aecosim is always going to be harder to learn, being a layered application. Compared to ArchiCAD and R*vit, Aecosim etc will came across more disjuncted. See the duplication of parametric tools (Triforma v Parametric Solids, information tagging (Datagroup v Element Types) and symbology (Family+Parts v Element Templates) etc. I suppose that this will resolve itself slowly as Bentley modernises its API's.

    Mstn is also very configuration needy, compared to the other apps that a student may be tempted to use. There has been some apps and changes that would help here, and may not be that critical for smaller student projetcs. AC and R*vit are also pretty config heavy for large projects. Recently, there has been more available online on LEARN etc that would help. It would be easy enough to provide a 'train the trainer/tutor' QuickStart.

    One success story, I am told, is STAAD which is very popular with student engineers because it is relatively simple to use and not very resource hungry. Result is a huge market share due to the number of graduates that can use it. Not sure what MEP students use these days. Maybe Bentley should push AES and Hevacomp and Siemen's SimCenter in the UK?

    Replicating the AutoCAD model of allowing 'free' or low cost copies of a CAD app is not enough these days. Everyone is doing it. There will need to other attractions or drivers. Over the years, powerful tools like GC and integrated rendering would have been good reasons for students to move to Mstn but just having the tools are not enough, you need to build mindshare and an ecosystem around them... as well as making the tools bug-free and reliable enough to be fun to be used. Big and high risk investments.

    nd more so where the product range seems to be becoming increaingly diversified and not really centered on any core.

    Funnily enough, it would appear that this is viewed as the way forward at YII 2018.

    "He adds that firms working on those types of specialist projects don’t want a ‘Swiss Army knife’ type product like Revit or ArchiCAD that they then have to try to customise extensively."

    Diversification and specialisation IS the current strategy for Aecosim.

    I assume also that students do not have access to the pricey Bentley learn server.   

    No, LEARN is free. You should try it. I think that you are probably thinking of ProjectWise, which now has a free / low cost PW Share app for registered users. It would be good to enhance this to make Mstn more attractive for student group projects.

    Especially for those universities that offer multi-disciplinary group projects. Most of them don't, and when they do, it tends to be quite badly done, and mainly to satisfy some box ticking requirements for accredidation purposes.

    What would be good is if the students would be allowed to use their lisences in a commercial context during their year out or during the year.

    The new generation of professionals are graduating with skills in Sketch up, Rhino, and God knows what else, a good majority with Revit which seems to be a more popular choice at the upper level.

    We see most students coming in with Rhino skills, who will need to be trained up to use something like R*vit or Mstn/Aecosim if they end up on a rail project. As mentioned elsewhere, it would be good to have a QuickStart for Rhino-to-Aecosim, in the same vein as the Mstn for AutoCAD users QuickStart.

    Even when R*vit is the designated house BIM app, a lot is still done in Rhino etc during the schematic design stages.

Reply
  • especially where there are easier to learn and simpler to use bits of software out there these days

    Yes, Mstn + Aecosim is always going to be harder to learn, being a layered application. Compared to ArchiCAD and R*vit, Aecosim etc will came across more disjuncted. See the duplication of parametric tools (Triforma v Parametric Solids, information tagging (Datagroup v Element Types) and symbology (Family+Parts v Element Templates) etc. I suppose that this will resolve itself slowly as Bentley modernises its API's.

    Mstn is also very configuration needy, compared to the other apps that a student may be tempted to use. There has been some apps and changes that would help here, and may not be that critical for smaller student projetcs. AC and R*vit are also pretty config heavy for large projects. Recently, there has been more available online on LEARN etc that would help. It would be easy enough to provide a 'train the trainer/tutor' QuickStart.

    One success story, I am told, is STAAD which is very popular with student engineers because it is relatively simple to use and not very resource hungry. Result is a huge market share due to the number of graduates that can use it. Not sure what MEP students use these days. Maybe Bentley should push AES and Hevacomp and Siemen's SimCenter in the UK?

    Replicating the AutoCAD model of allowing 'free' or low cost copies of a CAD app is not enough these days. Everyone is doing it. There will need to other attractions or drivers. Over the years, powerful tools like GC and integrated rendering would have been good reasons for students to move to Mstn but just having the tools are not enough, you need to build mindshare and an ecosystem around them... as well as making the tools bug-free and reliable enough to be fun to be used. Big and high risk investments.

    nd more so where the product range seems to be becoming increaingly diversified and not really centered on any core.

    Funnily enough, it would appear that this is viewed as the way forward at YII 2018.

    "He adds that firms working on those types of specialist projects don’t want a ‘Swiss Army knife’ type product like Revit or ArchiCAD that they then have to try to customise extensively."

    Diversification and specialisation IS the current strategy for Aecosim.

    I assume also that students do not have access to the pricey Bentley learn server.   

    No, LEARN is free. You should try it. I think that you are probably thinking of ProjectWise, which now has a free / low cost PW Share app for registered users. It would be good to enhance this to make Mstn more attractive for student group projects.

    Especially for those universities that offer multi-disciplinary group projects. Most of them don't, and when they do, it tends to be quite badly done, and mainly to satisfy some box ticking requirements for accredidation purposes.

    What would be good is if the students would be allowed to use their lisences in a commercial context during their year out or during the year.

    The new generation of professionals are graduating with skills in Sketch up, Rhino, and God knows what else, a good majority with Revit which seems to be a more popular choice at the upper level.

    We see most students coming in with Rhino skills, who will need to be trained up to use something like R*vit or Mstn/Aecosim if they end up on a rail project. As mentioned elsewhere, it would be good to have a QuickStart for Rhino-to-Aecosim, in the same vein as the Mstn for AutoCAD users QuickStart.

    Even when R*vit is the designated house BIM app, a lot is still done in Rhino etc during the schematic design stages.

Children
  • Is it . . .???   Not as at the last time I checked.   As far as I know free access to the Learn server (as in not having to pay £400.00 for a 1 hour Lecture - Not absolutely sure what the correct pricings are. . .) is covered by the annual Bentley Select Subscription paid per single licence such as I have, or for several licences which a larger practice will have.  This then enables each employee of the comapany access to the learn server without having to pay.  The big joke however is that 97.5% of such employees are unaware that this facility exists. However correct me if I am wrong and something has changed.   !!

    No, LEARN is free.
  • Don't take my word for it. Go to LEARN. Most of the vids are free.

    The big joke however is that 97.5% of such employees are unaware that this facility exists. However correct me if I am wrong and something has changed.

    That is down to your CAD / BIM Managers negiligence. The vids are also directly accessible from Mstn/Aecosim CE's Connect Advisor.

    It sounds like you are somewhat out of touch!