Start Invert not populating for ~90% of pipes in dataset

Hello Jamie, 

I was able to update your model with both start and stop nodes using the data provided by you for more than 90% of the conduits, though few had o levels after updating. 

Please make sure that you are mapping the start and stop levels correctly in Modelbuilder with correct settings.

Here is .mbc files with this settings I could get correct results, Import this .mbc file in your model at your system. Open Modelbuilder > Import connection and execute it, with build model set to yes. 

I tested your model in latest version, however you have 10.2.2.3 version, let me try in that version as well, to see if same results are achieved there, so I sent you .mbc file for now. 

Meanwhile here is detailed information about updating model with Modelbuilder. 

Using ModelBuilder to Import External Data

Please look for section, updating an existing model at the bottom. 

Ok last response: I have resolved this issue. The initial modelbuilder run when creating the model was not populating most of the start invert fields. I had to update the conduits with a second run with the establish connectivity using spatial data option not selected, which I hadn't been doing previously.

Is there some reason why, when initially building the model, most of start inverts weren't populating? There was no change in my dataset between initially creating the model, then trying to update it to get the inverts to populate.

Hi Jamie,

I took a look at your model and noticed that a large amount of the conduits had a start invert of zero already (before doing anything with ModelBuilder). For the initial attempt that you mentioned, was that the initial creation of the model? Meaning, are you saying that the issue is with updating an existing model, or with initial model creation?

If the "establish connectivity using spatial data" option is unchecked, then connectivity is established based on the "start node" and "stop node" fields in the field mapping step. This is important for the initial model creation and since you do not have start node and stop node attributes, then checking the box would be the correct approach. For updating element attributes in an existing model, this option is not important since the elements already exist and you would only need to check the box to "update existing objects...".

I tested a ModelBuilder run both ways and the start inverts populated without a problem. It is difficult to say why they didn't populate for you, without seeing your ModelBuilder configuration. If you would like to pursue this further, please provide the .MBC file (using the ModelBuilder configuration that demonstrates the issue in question) or screenshots of each ModelBuilder step so that we can reproduce the issue and provide a more specific answer.

Hi Jesse,

Yes, the issue occurred with the original creation of the model. It wasn't until I updated the model, using the same dataset, with the "establish connectivity..." option unchecked that I was able to populate all of the inverts.

While this has been resolved, I am curious to know why this cropped up during the initial model creation.

Attached is the .mbc file with the settings used upon model creation. I just  performed the initial model setup with those settings, with the same result. Also included is the manhole dataset, as that wasn't in my initial upload.

With that in mind (that I didn't include the manhole information) I ran the initial model setup without the manhole dataset, and all of  the inverts populated just fine. So this issue only occurred when performing the initial model setup with both the manholes, and conduit datasets. Sorry for not including that information originally, that was an oversight on my part.

My product version is Update 3 10.03.0.78

mbc file and Manholes.zip

Hi Jesse,

Yes, the issue occurred with the original creation of the model. It wasn't until I updated the model, using the same dataset, with the "establish connectivity..." option unchecked that I was able to populate all of the inverts.

While this has been resolved, I am curious to know why this cropped up during the initial model creation.

Attached is the .mbc file with the settings used upon model creation. I just  performed the initial model setup with those settings, with the same result. Also included is the manhole dataset, as that wasn't in my initial upload.

With that in mind (that I didn't include the manhole information) I ran the initial model setup without the manhole dataset, and all of  the inverts populated just fine. So this issue only occurred when performing the initial model setup with both the manholes, and conduit datasets. Sorry for not including that information originally, that was an oversight on my part.

My product version is Update 3 10.03.0.78

mbc file and Manholes.zip

Hello Jamie,

I checked the shapefiles you shared for manholes and conduits. Here are my observations;

For the manholes shapefile you have the attributes for both Elevation (Ground) being mapped with "RIMELEV" and Elevation (Inver) being mapped with "UPELEV_MIN". However, there are about 148 manholes where the "UPELEV_MIN" value is absent and another 24 manholes where the value is "0".

For the conduit shapefile you have the upstream and downstream elevation values and not the actual manhole labels to be mapped. You require these attributes to be mapped in the Start and Stop field in the conduit shapefile.

Jamie Purdy said:

With that in mind (that I didn't include the manhole information) I ran the initial model setup without the manhole dataset, and all of  the inverts populated just fine. So this issue only occurred when performing the initial model setup with both the manholes, and conduit datasets. Sorry for not including that information originally, that was an oversight on my part.

In this case when you are bringing in the data using both the manhole and conduit shapefiles you can get the manhole data without any issues but the conduit shapefile does not have the start and stop node attributes hence you have to choose "establish connectivity using spatial data" to map to the closest manholes.

When you are running the ModelBuilder with only the conduit shapefile the upstream and downstream manholes are automatically created you would have to check the option of "Create nodes if none found at pipe endpoint" to make sure that your upstream and downstream manholes are generated. However, these wont be as per your GIS-ID's for the manholes and they also won't have any elevation data by themselves.

I tested two runs of your model in which first I tried simply importing both shapefiles without using the option for spatial join and the results were satisfactory. I was seeing the start invert elevations for my conduits. When the inverts were set to "Set Invert to Start?" they have taken the manhole invert values and if you globally uncheck this or set it to "False" the invert levels specified in the conduit shapefile have also been imported. The same is the case when the spatial join option is used.

When I checked the model it seems that most of the manholes which have a zero invert level do not have any conduit associated with them so these values are not reflected in the conduit invert values.