turn on/off layers on sheet file, then exchange to master file the level is on/off again

I don't follow your workflow.

Where are you making the change to the level being on or off ? in the sheet or in the master reference ? I don't want to know what you are expecting to happen, only what you are specifically doing.

Are you turning on/off global display or view display ?

Do you want changes in the level on/off to reflect thru to every sheet or only the one you have open ?

I'm controlling the level on/off display through the Master file, view display. I want changes in the level on/off to reflect thru to every sheet

Once again, I'm confused.

You have these sheets. They are all the same "type" of sheet, so you want all the levels to be displayed (on/off) the same in all the sheets, so you are trying to control that from the Master file. Am I right so far?

Because you talk about the "levels in the different sheets" - I don't know what those are or where they are coming from if they all have the same display. I literally have no idea what you mean.

Also, you may start out controlling level display from a master file, but if anyone at any time changes a level attribute in the sheet, that cuts the control from the master and changes it to the sheet. There's no real way to get it back after that.

Maybe to simplify. Level display is controlled independently in each model, whether a sheet, design or drawing. So you can't simply adjust the master file and have it show up in the sheets that way. You can use Global Display or Freeze to accomplish that. Also, save settings on exit and save changes are 2 different settings.

 I open a sheet file the levels are correct, but when I exchange, to the master file, levels that are in the different sheets are back on.

This is confusing to me. If you exchange into the master file - how can you see that the levels are incorrect in the other sheet files ?

This project is 2 miles road, and the master file is in model space with all attached files I need (basemap, proposed design file, bridges files, etc.), and it is 16 cut sheets files. In the master file there are some levels in the bridge file I don't want to print, so I turned it off. But when I open a sheet file that doesn't have the bridge in, and then exchange to master file (that is in model space), the levels on the bridge file are back on.  

And what happens if you open a sheet that has the bridge in it - does that sheet still look fine?

And what happens if you open a sheet that has the bridge in it - does that sheet still look fine?

MaryB said:

"Always" and "Never" are settings for New Level Display, and they have no bearing on the display settings of existing levels.

I suspect she meant that Display Overrides are set to Always, not New Level Display.

@Lucilia: I've done exactly what you are doing with a single master file being used to control the level display of attached files and then display that composition on multiple sheets (albeit for Rail Electrification projects not Highways). I use the same drawing composition & reference file attachment routine on every project I work on (even just simple architectural drawings) and it always gives me consistent expected behaviour. There is 1 key aspect necessary which has not been mentioned once in any of the comments so I don't know if you are using it or not: Saved Views.

Here is what I do...

In the Master File:

1. Attach all your Reference Files
2. Turn on/off the required levels for each reference file
3. Apply any require Level Overrides (symbology)
4. Create a saved view of the entire route fitted to your view (you can make multiple i.e.1 per sheet if for some reason you need different level displays per sheet but if not, its not necessary as you can just slide the Reference File (attached using Saved View) and adjust the boundary to show only what you want to see in each sheet)

In each sheet File:

1. Open your Sheet Model
2. Attach the Master File using the following settings:
   1. Orientation = Your Saved View Name
   2. Scale = Whatever you need it to be
   3. Nested Attachments = Live Nesting (Depth set to 2)
   4. Display Overrides = Never
   5. Synchronize View = All

After which I typically draw a shape assigned to a non-plotting level and use that as the clipping boundary for the master file's saved view reference attachment, then add any necessary annotation and finally edit the title block. Its easy to move to the next sheet in the series by doing a Save As and sliding the Saved View as required.

If you are wondering why I have covered all of the above then keep reading. One of the great things about this method is that it doesn't matter if someone else opens you Master File and makes changes to the level display of View 1 etc... The display of current levels when you open the file (either directly by file manager or by exchange) is irrelevant!. All you need to do is open the master file and apply the saved view and you will get the same appearance as what is visible on your drawing. Same principle if you are asked to change the display of levels across all your sheets: Open the Master File, apply the saved view, adjust your levels as required and update the saved view (Do Not Tick Update Camera Position!!! or your reference file will move on your sheet). Only when you update the saved view will the changes propagate through to your sheets. Users cannot make changes from the Sheet, the Master File is the single source of truth!

Using this method also means I have no need for fannying about with Global Display/Freeze or configuration variables either (I personally only ever use View Display anyway)

Berry,

Thank you for sharing your method, but I can't try doing it right now, because I have set up all the sheets already (more than 200 for the whole project), it would be too much of hassle to re-attach the master file with the saved view.

First  off IMHO would not use your  work flow or settings as its incompatible for what you want to achieve but as you say 200 sheets later it can be a bit painful.

First off I never have save settings set on exit... Others may open your files have a look around turn things on and off  and if they  exit  the save settings on exit will  ruin your drawings.( also hard to do a what if with Engineer  over your shoulder saying  can turn this on and that  off so I can see better  you cant really  go back easy) ..  I always us control F  if I want settings saved and dont  if I don't want level display changes saved and if you do it for a week  it will be come intuitive.

Now you can't use  One master Nested reference for every drawing  its not stable and will drive you to distraction as you have discovered.. If some drawings must not show certain things like drainage not to be shown  then make a Different nested file and  use that  instead on those plans that need it.. obviously  you need to name it logically..

Now to help you there is a free too RefRename.mvba  floating around to batch replace reference file  it uses a GUI  and  you tell it to find ref  X and replace it with Ref Y  in drawings  Z1,Z2 etc ( this is the batch processing part so you browse and select the drawings you want to process only) its a bit tricky to work out as the docs aren't too good... but I have my own docs on my  work pc how to do it Im not sure if its VBA or Mdl as I havet run it in quite a long time.. if you have projectwise its pretty easy to do without this tool as it ags tools of its own...

ok found link to down load tool  docs included .. be warned it will fail if you have any xref attached more than once in the same drg file

/cfs-file/__key/communityserver-discussions-components-files/273/RefRename.zip

Hi Lorys

Lorys said:

First off I never have save settings set on exit... Others may open your files have a look around turn things on and off  and if they  exit  the save settings on exit will  ruin your drawings.( also hard to do a what if with Engineer  over your shoulder saying  can turn this on and that  off so I can see better  you cant really  go back easy) ..  I always us control F  if I want settings saved and dont  if I don't want level display changes saved and if you do it for a week  it will be come intuitive.

That's one of the reasons why I'm an advocate for using saved views as a key component of my sheet composition workflow i.e. it doesn't matter in someone turns levels and/or reference files on/off because the changes don't automatically propagate through to the sheet. I experienced your Engineer scenario example myself many times and if I need to get back the currently as-displayed on sheet appearance, I just apply the saved view to View 1 when I'm in the Master File/Composition Model.

FWIW: I do personally use 'Save Settings On Exit'. Sure its a personal preference but the setting does not give any negative affects to my workflow and I know I would lose more work exiting models & drawings forgetting not to save before I exit.

Lorys said:

Now you can't use  One master Nested reference for every drawing  its not stable and will drive you to distraction as you have discovered.

I'm unsure of the context of the comment i.e. whether it refers to either:

1. A single master file in which you reference every single project DGN file into e.g. Architectural Plans, elevations, sections, Topographical surveys, Structural Engineer's drawings etc... or,
2. A single Master file which is used for a specific series of drawings that only showcase part of an overall larger layout e.g. Highways, Railways, Large Site Plans etc...

If its the former then I would agree as from my experience that is akin to how AutoCAD users work (albeit the users I have worked with draw every single thing in just 1 DWG File and create multiple sheet models in the same file) However if its the latter then I will have to disagree with your statement, what you are saying is entirely the opposite of what that workflow provides. Using a master file/composition model to control the levels and appearance of each reference attachment ensures consistency across every drawing in the series.

I've posted these images previously in another thread but these are a relevant previous example I created using the outlined workflow:

The 1st drawing (above) displays the entire route and its Master File/Composition Model contains the following:

• OS Map - to give the viewer enough context of the overall route. No other project files are attached due to the scale of 1:25,000 as they would not be legible.
• Sheet Display Zone - Red rectangles which indicate the area covered in each sheet

All annotations are added onto the sheets.

The 2nd drawing (above) displays the 1st of the Red rectangles at the West end of the route and its Master File/Composition Model contains the following:

• OS Map - As above
• Electrical Engineers Plans (32 Total: 1 DGN per electrification segment called a Track Unit and an additional segment at each end called a 'Tie-In')
• GIS Plan - Exported data from ARCGIS
• Route Ownership Plan - Route-wide boundary outline of land owned by Network Rail
• Civil Engineers Foundation types plan: Route-wide plan containing symbols representing the type of foundation required under each electrification structure
• Civil Engineers Track Unit Boundary Plan: Route-wide plan displaying the boundaries for the Track Units and Tie-Ins

Again, all annotations are added onto the sheets.

@Lucilia: You wouldn't have to reattach, all you would need to do after creating the saved view(s) in the Master File/Composition Model is this:

1. Open a sheet
2. Display the reference manager dialog
3. Click in the orientation column for the attached reference file and navigate down the list to where your saved view is listed and select it.
4. Select the Reference Presentation column (or press its button) and change Synchronize View to All Settings
5. Change the Display Overrides to Never
6. Adjust Nesting Depth if required.

What will likely happen is your reference view will move position from where it was so what you would do before step 3 is draw a line to a known easily identifiable point on the reference file. The after completing step 6 you can reposition the reference file back to where it was before and then adjust its clipping boundary if needed. I appreciate you have a lot of drawings but the situation is rescuable if you ever need to do it.

@Barry - what is your workflow when you make a change to the levels ? you have to remember to update the saved view. Also the synchronized views in the references are not all automatically updated once you make a change to the saved view. You have to make sure you go back to each attachment and update the synchronized views for each reference using that saved view.  I don't see you saving much effort here.