Subtract Solid (v8i) vs Difference Feature (CE)

I'm trying to get up to speed with CE equivalency to the way I've worked in v8i and am getting stuck with the simple task of subtracting solids.

The two slides below show my attempt to replicate the Subtract Solids function in v8i. The task is simple - to subtract the green object from the grey object so that I'm left with two grey objects. Ultimately, I want to delete one of the grey objects.

Please let me know where I'm going wrong. Frankly, I'd rather not end up with Parametric Solids - I have no use for them and would like to work only with simple Solids and Smart Solids.

Thanks,

PS> I know someone's going to want to know my Microstation version number, but if I type the word "version" into the much-hyped search box I get no hits. I know it's Update 15, but can't find the specific build.

  • Hi Max,

    The two slides below show my attempt to replicate the Subtract Solids function in v8i.

    What function do you use in V8i and what do you use in CE? Some 3D tools are still available in "original form" in toolboxes, but not in ribbon.

    Please let me know where I'm going wrong.

    I think you do nothing wrong. Be aware that solid modeling was reworked and is based on concepts (and different Parasolid engine).

    But everything from V8i should be possible to do in CE. Will have to think about it a bit more ;-)

    To share your DGN would make testing simpler...

    I know someone's going to want to know my Microstation version number, but if I type the word "version" into the much-hyped search box I get no hits.

    The key-in is "version" ;-)

    Regards,

      Jan

  • Hi Max,

    just a quick testing done:

    Please let me know where I'm going wrong.

    Nothing. Even when to use Subtract solid in V8i but Difference Feature in CE automatically leads to a conclusion the result will be different.

    Please let me know where I'm going wrong.

    In my opinion the tool does exactly what it should do: It creates a difference between two solids. The result is still one solid, but represented by 2 separate parts.

    Frankly, I'd rather not end up with Parametric Solids - I have no use for them and would like to work only with simple Solids and Smart Solids.

    Solids and SmartSolids is kept for backward compatibility only. But, I agree, in some situations are simpler to be used ;-)

    Use Ctrl+T (opens Tool Boxes dialog) and choose Legacy Modify Solid tool box. It's the original V8i tool.

    When you need to convert parametric solid to SmartSolid, use Drop element with Application Elements set  on.

    With regards,

      Jan

    Answer Verified By: Max Voigt 

  • Thanks Jan - the availability of legacy tools is a revelation and has made CE usable for my purposes for the first time.

    I can understand how Difference Feature applies semantically to the concept of removing a chunk out of an object - but if the action separates the object into two objects, then I want to have two objects and not have Microstation insist that they are somehow still a single object.

    I've been battling with the parametric concept, finding myself using  Drop element / Application Elements quite a lot to get things back to familiar territory.

    The key-in is "version" ;-)

    Thanks for this too - I had to search for "key-in" in order to enter a key-in. V8i's two click Help> About was so much more intuitive, don't you think?

  • Key-In Window

    I type the word "version" into the much-hyped search box I get no hits

    The search box deserves to be much-hyped.  It's useful for finding tools.

    But it's not the command key-in window that you're familiar with in V8.  Type 'key in' in the search window to find the key-in dialog in CONNECT.

    Version key-in

    I've posted this blog that shows how to find MicroStation's version.

    Visual Communication

    Great illustrations, by the way!  If only everyone was as visually fluent.

     
    Regards, Jon Summers
    LA Solutions

  • Hi Max,

    but if the action separates the object into two objects, then I want to have two objects and not have Microstation insist that they are somehow still a single object.

    in my opinion it's a misunderstanding how parametric modeling works: What is displayed as two solids is a result of operations, applied to input solids. So they are not two elements, but one result.

    But, I agree, it would be nice to have such tool available. I asked specifically about such feature in this post.

    I've been battling with the parametric concept

    I think it's a common problem :-)

    But, my experience is, that there are many things that can be done using new tools far easier and elegant ... but also, some things cannot be done at all or are complicated. Plus, GUI is still not powerful enough and cannot be compared to flexibility of some other modeling applications.

    Often the biggest challenge (for me) is to find the right tool. E.g. for the discussed situation, when you know only one result is required, there are two ways how to create the expected result using parametric tools:

    • To use Trim Solid tool, because "to trim" means "keep one side only".
    • To use Subtract solids tool (Difference feature) as you did, and in the next step to delete one from the results using Delete piece tool.

    Of course, the results, even when the same visually, are different solids, because constructed using different set of operations (the parametric tree is different).

    but if I type the word "version" into the much-hyped search box

    Because there is no tool or dialog named "version". You wrote it already yourself: It's About, and when you will search for it, you will receive the expected result.

    With regards,

      Jan