associative_offset_problem.dgn
Hello, I uploaded the file so you can try replicate the problem yourself, pick any face of any element a try to associative offset. It says change rejected ....
Another sub question, when i copied paste these few elements to create uploaded file the orientation after pasting was non sensical. My accudraw settigns in both models were set to top but when copy paste it was put into viewlike position. ODD!
Thanks for having a look,
The solids in the file you shared are "Smart Solids" The tool is meant to work with the newer "Parametric Solids" see the documentation:
https://docs.bentley.com/LiveContent/web/MicroStation%20Help-v18/en/AssociativeExtraction.html
In your case the correct tool would be the older extract faces/edges tool:
https://docs.bentley.com/LiveContent/web/MicroStation%20Help-v18/en/MSJ3DUtilityExtractFaceorEdge.html
Ivan Galik said:Another sub question, when i copied paste these few elements to create uploaded file the orientation after pasting was non sensical. My accudraw settigns in both models were set to top but when copy paste it was put into viewlike position. ODD!
Just accudraw was set to top or the view as well. When copying to the clipboard the view orientation is used.
is there a way to promote smart solid to parametric solid? after i apply any feature it turns into parametric solid but i want it before any feature applied. Almost everytime there is no need to keep history of how shape was obtained and its turned at some point into smart solid. But things like associative offset would be useful working on only smart solids as well. I dont see any reason why it should not be allowed. Is there some deeper reason? Associavity is key otherwise it is not useful at all. I assign to associative face finish surface and when i edit parent smart solid i want associative offset face (finish surface) to be updated. Second topic: copy paste seems quite rubish in microstation unfortunately.
Hi Ivan,
Ivan Galik said:is there a way to promote smart solid to parametric solid?
In CE when you do a simple Unity from two basic cubes or some other form of solid like primitives the result is a parametric solid.
If you do a simple operation to add/remove something from the smart solid using parametric operations the result will be a parametric solid, after you can use the Associative Extraction.
Ivan Galik said:associative offset would be useful working on only smart solids as well. I dont see any reason why it should not be allowed.
That would be great.
Ivan Galik said:copy paste seems quite rubish in microstation unfortunately.
Everyone around here believe it's far better than others. It's WAD and it's great.
Regards
José
HI Ivan,
No. Smart Solids and Parametric Solids are completely different technology. It's not about tools and/or modeling engine, but completely different way how solids are created, described and stored.
Smart Solids have long history (at least from V8) and are represented using b-rep, saved as cells. No solid history is maintained, geometry is always available (because it's b-rep ;-) and the approach is "like sculpting" (even when sculpting tools, available in other software today, are far more powerful).
Parametric Solids are CE feature, represented as feature tree, where every node represents object (shape...) or operation (extrusion...). No geometry is stored, only the tree.
Because of these technologies features, it's simple to convert parametric solid to b-rep (because geometry is calculated automatically), whereas there is no general solution how to convert smart solid to parametric solid (but smart solid can be an input for parametric modeling).
Ivan Galik said:Almost everytime there is no need to keep history of how shape was obtained
This is very bold statement and in my opinion is generally wrong (but right in specific project or model context).
Ivan Galik said:and its turned at some point into smart solid.
Which is simple and can make sense in some step of a modeling workflow.
I recommend to see this discussion, discussing similar topic (smart solid vs parametric solid).
Ivan Galik said: dont see any reason why it should not be allowed. Is there some deeper reason?
Probably there is. As developer, I can imagine several obstacles: a data, necessary for such feature, is not available/stored in smart solid; modeling kernel (Parasolid) does not allow to implement such feature; smart solids are now "side technology" and the whole effort is focused on parametric modeling.
Ivan Galik said:Second topic: copy paste seems quite rubish in microstation unfortunately.
No second topic! Please respect this forum best practices!
When you have any problem with copy/paste, post new question. I guess the problem is that you use wrong tool or the right tool, but in wrong way. There is nothing rubbish in copying elements.
Regards,
Jan
Bentley Accredited Developer: iTwin Platform - AssociateLabyrinth Technology | dev.notes() | cad.point
Jose Pinho said:If you do a simple operation to add/remove something from the smart solid using parametric operations the result will be a parametric solid, after you can use the Associative Extraction.
yeah i noticed when i apply unnoticable fillet for example i can suddenly use associative offset. thats why i am asking how i can promote a smart solid into parametric one which would basically mean assinging "null" parametric feature onto the smart solid behind the scenes. for me it absolutely makes sense that this should be possible but without assigning unneccessary feature.