How is this even possible. I am working on setting up tables for use on our projects. I have been experimenting with the various options to figure what works & what does not. Using CE 16.3 I was having an issue with the Import from File (Excel). In CE 16.3 I have a seed table created with the appropriate column headers and a title. Then I have several empty rows.
Using the Place Empty table the inserted table looks like this (seed table name is PointList). This seed table contains the correct formatting for the rows, columns & cells.
Placing another table and selecting From File I select the seed table. Then I select the Excel file, which only contains data that should populate the body of the table (no title or column headers).
When I place the table, the first row of data is inserted into the 3rd row of the table overwriting the Northing & Easting column headers.
There is no solution for this but, I did find a forum post describing this same issue.
Talking with a colleague earlier today, they mentioned that the table tool had some updates in CE 17 so I thought I would see if my table would work in there.
WOW! is about all I can say. Unless I am missing something, they broke this tool's limited functionality.
In CE 17 I selected the Place Table tool and selected From File once again. With this version you cannot even pick a table seed. You can only select a Table Style.
Table Style???? What's that? No surprise here, looking at the Help Documentation the only information provided is
The Ribbon tool group they reference does not contain this tool. You need to select a table that was already placed and formatted. Once you select an existing table in the file the Layout tab becomes visible and contains the Save Style tool.
So I placed my PointList tabled seed, selected it and used the Save Style tool. Going back to the Place Table tool & selecting From File the Style I saved (just named it Style1) is in the list of Table Styles. So I set that style, selected my Excel file and placed the table in my file. I had to chuckle in dismay when I saw the result
The table is placed on the correct level but, the color, weight & style are all 0. Notice there are no grid lines and the title row & column header rows are non-existent as well. Ok, select the the new table and check the properties dialog. Looking at the General section the Color Style & weight of the table are not set bylevel, even though the original table was set that way. Attempting to change those settings, only the color attribute changed.
For the Text Styles section the Default Text Color & Weight were set to From Table, even though the original table was set to use Color 0 & Weight 3. Trying to change those settings failed as well. Going to the Layout tab and trying to turn the Borders on fails as well.
Anyone else noticing these issues with Place Tables in CE 17?
mwlong said:I had to chuckle in dismay
The Table tools have always been dodgy. It's disappointing to read that their usefulness is worsening rather than improving.
What's puzzling is why, as others such as Ian Lapper have asked many times, Bentley Systems don't offer new or changed functionality or new or changed tools to the community for β-testing (beta-testing). Then stuff like your experience could be caught before it escapes into a released product.
Regards, Jon Summers LA Solutions
Jon Summers said:The Table tools have always been dodgy
I agree that the tool is lacking but, I actually had workflows that made it very useful. Now the tool is basically useless. How many years until they address this one?
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Something I notice in CE 17 Place Table is that I believe the Table Style is supposed to be specific to the From Report mode. When you look at the Help file it only mentions From Report. When you set the Place Table mode to Blank Table or From Report you still have the option to select a Table Seed & Table Style. When you switch the mode to From File the Table Seed field is missing.
Also, in From File mode there is an icon to the right of the field. Clicking that button brings up a dialog stating that a Table Seed & Report need to be selected
When you set the Table Tool to From File only the Table Seed field is available and there is no icon to the right of the field. My guess is that the programmer inadvertently changed he code for this tool and the field should be Table Seed.
Hi mwlong, apologize for the inconvenience.
1. The gear icon is for generating a report table which titles/headers/bodys/summary rows can be specified from designated rows of the seed, this feature can be hidden by uncheck item "MaintainTableSeed" from the configure step of installer when install or modify Microstation.
2. Table Style feature can be hidden by uncheck item "TableStyle" also from the configure step of installer. After unchecking, the seed dropdown list will appear for Excel tab.
Colin Wang said:this feature can be hidden by uncheck item "MaintainTableSeed" from the configure step of installer when install or modify Microstation
CAD Admins are accustomed to configuring MicroStation through the use of configuration variables defined in configuration files. They can apply settings to projects and sites through the judicious use of those variables. The CAD Admin can modify a configuration easily by redefining those variables.
Now you've introduced a new configuration step at installation time. I don't like the sound of that. From the CAD Admin's point of view, installation is an irreversible step, often outside their direct control (it could be IT's responsibility to install software). What is the reasoning behind defining part of MicroStation's configuration on installation?
Colin Wang said: from the configure step of installer
WHY???? Why is it setup this way and why is there no documentation on this prior to installation?
Jon Summers said:CAD Admins are accustomed to configuring MicroStation through the use of configuration variables
Yes, this is true. A simple configuration variable would follow how everything else is done. As Jon stats, running the installer to enable/disable a feature is not easily done. This would need to be run on all pc's rather than adding/modifying a single variable in a Corporate config file.
Going back and running the installer to modify the options as stated I see there are a lot of options in there. Is this how Bentley is incorporating the Tech Previews moving forward? Where is the documentation that explains what each option is for so we can enable them when we install a version for testing? Why do we need to contact Bentley to figure out how to enable a Tech Preview?
Colin Wang said:1. The gear icon is for generating a report table which titles/headers/bodys/summary rows can be specified from designated rows of the seed, this feature can be hidden by uncheck item "MaintainTableSeed" from the configure step of installer when install or modify Microstation. 2. Table Style feature can be hidden by uncheck item "TableStyle" also from the configure step of installer. After unchecking, the seed dropdown list will appear for Excel tab.
I just unchecked these boxes and it reverts the Place Table tool back. But, what good is this? Now you can't test the Tech Previews without modifying the installation again. Those of us that are testing new features also work on production of active projects. Often times I am interrupted during testing to work on billable work and I need to jump back & forth. Now you are introducing a method that will likely cause problems with the installation over time. There has to be a better way of handling the toggling of these settings.
There really shouldn't be ANYTHING extra to set in the installation that is not systemic to the installation. That is NOT where something as isolated as "Table Styles" belongs.
As mentioned by others, CAD Admins are not often the ones installing the software. IT installs the software, and IT does not involve itself in the daily operation of that software (many of them could care less about specifics). CAD admins set up and maintain the software configuration - and may not even have the permissions to change the installation.
Configuration is done through configuration variables. it should NOT be done through installation unless there is a VERY good reason (and "table styles" is not it). That change also needs to be Announced and Documented, even for "previews".
MaryB
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