Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 15:51:01 GMT

That bottom left message usually screams what not to do and what it does not accept, but it does not say what to do, or if does- vaguely. Just like in my case: how would I interpret a prompt for Rail Track without knowing exactly what it means and what to select. This is where cheat sheet explanation what Rail Track means would be essential and prudent: ok, select element associated with rails, behind the rail line, not the centerline.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Dan Olausen — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 15:39:26 GMT

I do not disagree, just would suggest you always look at the bottom left of the Program when using ANY command. Within reason, it tells you what it wants you to do/click on or do.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 15:09:20 GMT

I would strongly suggest Bentley to create 'cheat sheet', a vocabulary of terminology used in the program (hopefully written by native English speakers, not ESL!), explaining what those are, what they do, and where and how to use them. Better be within the program itself, not elsewhere on the website requiring a lot of extra time to find.

Unfortunately, Help contents and reference items do not explain commands, but rather repeat what command says in the menu which is very vague. Not much help, isn't it....

Now, later versions (Open series) introduced all these weird manipulations with keys (alt, shift, ctrl, space bar, whatever else...) that should be just simple mouse clicks somewhere in one place. Can never remember what those keys do, and certainly can't understand the logic behind this routine if any. Is there a cheat sheet for those? Generally, key-in methodology is so outdated, like archaic DOS, and so annoyingly autocad-ish thus counterproductive!

There must be a better help and guidance.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

jpln — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:45:52 GMT

yes correct. Railways and routes are more the rail network model. Railtrack is the track structure (without ballast)

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

jpln — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:44:19 GMT

It should be here What's New? (bentley.com)

But for this one it is missing

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:41:39 GMT

I see this is totally different from Routes and Railways I use in Overhead Line Designer

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:40:55 GMT

it DID allow to create rails, but not ties

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:39:50 GMT

Thanks! It did work!

Now, how in the world are we supposed to know this????? In addition to persistent funny foreign terminology, there are no instructions on updates and changes from Bentley whatsoever.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Dan Olausen — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:23:55 GMT

If it won't let you create rails on your alignment, then I would guess you have issues with the alignment.

If you click the alignment, go to Properties and take a screenshot...

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

jpln — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:16:05 GMT

A new object "railtrack" has been introduced to handle rails, joints and maybe more in the future.

So when you are prompted ot select the railtrack it is not the centerline, it is the railtrack. It is coincident to the rails (inside edge and centerline) and includes both. It is created in level "Default". There is no feature def for the "railtrack". You can change the level after creation.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:14:13 GMT

trying.... gives an error after uploading when trying to post. Must be too large.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Dan Olausen — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 13:00:46 GMT

Can you share the file?

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 12:58:02 GMT

I used project-specific, developed by the client, feature definitions for centerlines (I have multiple tracks), so as for rails. It goes successfully through the rails creation routine (select alignment, select cant/ superelevation), then Create Ties generates different prompt- that little pesky, annoying pop-up little box attached to the cursor that wasn't there in SS10 or earlier. I can enter all tie parameters (there are all different concrete ties for freight Class Ones mains, facilities, and passenger lines) in the dialog but it would not allow selecting the alignment. Clearly the wording of the prompt is different from what training materials are showing. I can't really take a screen shot to illustrate since the prompt is up only when the cursor is within the field. The wording of this pesky prompt has changed, and I am not sure when and why, and I have not a faintest idea how to restore it back.

Would that be anything to do with the alignment itself? Since Connect edition alignment tools are not as well controlled, having some hidden connections to graphical elements, I am not sure what and where to look for a problem.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Dan Olausen — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 12:44:09 GMT

I don't disagree with you. The training video for create sleepers simply says in the video to click on the rail track. Well, if one is trying to simply create sleepers and they watch that video, that isn't super helpful if you have missed a step.

The short video segments should include requirements such as, to create sleepers you need an alignment with an active profile, a rail track that is generated by creating rails, etc.

Whatever the case, upgrade to the latest version ASAP.

2021R1 was a HOT MESS of a program. 2021R2 was somewhat workable, and 2022R1 appears to have fixed some things in 2021R2. Bentley appears to be heading in the correct direction from what I am seeing.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 12:37:46 GMT

I did all this training long ago, not just by videos, but Bentley did project-specific training for our company directly. It was working back then. Now there is a different prompt, and it would not allow me to select track alignment- that's the whole point. Tried to submit tickets but they respond from somewhere abroad barely speaking English, collecting information saying they will respond or asking if I would want to do live session, and never getting back to me after the initial response. Of course, the program terminology is totally foreign too.

In a perfect world of training videos everything seems to be ship shape. In the reality of projects it turns out totally different. Training PDFs guiding through dataset and exercise are quite vague too.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Dan Olausen — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 12:37:00 GMT

I just did it in the latest version and did not have any issues. In the latest version, you have 2 feature definitions you have to select (one for centerline and one for inside edge) and a template for the rails. When you select all 3, you click on your alignment to generate the rails. It will generate the "Rail Track" you are looking for. Once the "Rail Track" is generated, you can create the sleepers.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 12:35:35 GMT

Used 2021 R1, then yesterday after fiddling with this 'Create Ties' routine upgraded to 2021 R2. The same results. It should not be a matter of version at all.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Alex Marina Nelson — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 12:33:48 GMT

I am aware of the workflow: the rails must be created first. I did initially created rails, then got the prompt 'Select Existing Rail Track' instead of 'Select Track Centerline' as supposed to. Whatever Existing Rail Track means.... never seen it before since started using Open Rail few years ago.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Dan Olausen — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 12:31:08 GMT

Honestly, sleepers is not something I use yet. From my limited experience, EBlach is correct in that you need to create rails first. A somewhat minor hint, the toolbar is pretty much in order of operations, which is probably why the Create Rails Function is on top/to the left of the Create Sleepers button.

Go to the Learn Server (learn.bentley.com), and follow the path:

00 - Rail Design & Modeling - Fundamentals Learning Path

Under that, it walks you through how to use the software.

I would select

QuickStart for OpenRail Designer

as that gives you the basic steps you appear to be trying to accomplish. You might have to read through the lines a bit,

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

EBlach — Fri, 07 Oct 2022 06:59:18 GMT

I'm fairly certain you need to create rails first, then you can attach sleepers.

RE: Create Sleepers (well those are called TIES)- incorrect prompt?

Dan Olausen — Thu, 06 Oct 2022 22:16:08 GMT

First off, what version are you using?

To answer your second question, alignments are automatically created in a new 3D model if the alignment is 3D. Have you created a profile? Set the profile to active?