RAM Concept Load History Deflections

We are currently working on a RC garage model (11” slab thickness, max span ≈34’).  We are noticing that our load history deflections are much larger than we are expecting.

When we run load history deflections we get a Final Instantaneous Deflection of 3.257” in our worst span.

We created a load combination based off of ACI 318-9.5.2.5 to compare this to.  The load combination we created essential takes sustained loads (DL + 10%LL + 50%ParkingLL), multiplies them by the long-term multiplier from ACI, and then adds in Service loads (DL+LL).  Using 2.0 as a conservative value for the long-term multiplier, our resulting load combination is as follows:

Using this formulation, we get a maximum deflection of 1.044" from the 'Max Deflection' plot under the load combination.

We are aware of some of the reasons stated in Section 65 of the Concept Manual as to why some deflection results are lower than those calculated in Load History deflections, but we are having a difficult time making sense of the difference being 3x what ACI predicts.

Are there any other reasons that could explain the large discrepancy?

I have attached the model in question for reference.

Thanks

Garage Model.zip
Parents
  • When the Load history deflection predicts significantly larger deflection than a standard combinations times the creep factor, it's usually a matter of cracking. I use the Service Design - ECR plots to gauge the amount of predicted cracking, and in your model at many of the supports, the cracking results in approximately double curvature, over 50% cracked.

    The other thing to watch out for are sections with no equilibrium. In your Load History Calc log there are dozens of these warnings. Here is the first:

    Calculating Instantaneous Cross Section Load History Curvatures for Load Step Maximum Short Term Load Iteration 3 Cross section 437 has no equilibrium at (-251,9.199) (-257.6,9.199). Setting element stiffness to be very small.

    So with all these fully cracked sections it's no surprise that the final load history results are so large. To improve the behavior, you might have to add some more user reinforcement, assuming there are no problems with the loads, load history steps or strip layout. As a test I increase the #5 @ 12 bottom bars to #6 at 12 and the max long term deflection dropped slightly to 3.0".



    Answer Verified By: PPesek 

Reply
  • When the Load history deflection predicts significantly larger deflection than a standard combinations times the creep factor, it's usually a matter of cracking. I use the Service Design - ECR plots to gauge the amount of predicted cracking, and in your model at many of the supports, the cracking results in approximately double curvature, over 50% cracked.

    The other thing to watch out for are sections with no equilibrium. In your Load History Calc log there are dozens of these warnings. Here is the first:

    Calculating Instantaneous Cross Section Load History Curvatures for Load Step Maximum Short Term Load Iteration 3 Cross section 437 has no equilibrium at (-251,9.199) (-257.6,9.199). Setting element stiffness to be very small.

    So with all these fully cracked sections it's no surprise that the final load history results are so large. To improve the behavior, you might have to add some more user reinforcement, assuming there are no problems with the loads, load history steps or strip layout. As a test I increase the #5 @ 12 bottom bars to #6 at 12 and the max long term deflection dropped slightly to 3.0".



    Answer Verified By: PPesek 

Children
  • Taking your suggestions from above, we tried to remove those two issues.

    If we set our slab thickness to 18" in that same model, and rerun, we no longer get ECR spikes at the columns and equilibrium errors are reduced to just a couple that are not located near the maximum deflection point.

    With those two errors/issues worked out, we were left with the following deflection values:

    ACI 9.5 Method: 0.4153"

    Load History Final Instantaneous: 1.17"

    Any other thoughts on what might be causing the large discrepancy? 

    Answer Verified By: PPesek 

    Garage Model w 18in slab.zip

  • Your Creep factor is 3.35, but your Dead load factor is only 3, reducing the creep factor to 3 would align better with your custom combo.

    It's also informative to look at the second step "Sustained Load" vs. the "Final Instantaneous Load" step since your custom combo only represents half the Parking load sustained.

    When I even the playing field in those ways, the load history sustained result is 1.0", still significantly larger that your combo.

    We can deduce that the effects of shrinkage are significant. As a test I reduced the shrinkage restraint percentage from 10 to 1% and then the sustained deflections are dramatically reduced to 0.36". For more on the use of shrinkage restraint in load history calculations, check out this article:

    communities.bentley.com/.../6191.aspx



    Answer Verified By: PPesek 

  • Thanks for the help.  We'll be looking more closely at some of these factors in the load history deflections.

    Answer Verified By: PPesek 

  • Seth,

    I have similar issues with deflections and just saw this thread.

    You mention: "When the Load history deflection predicts significantly larger deflection than a standard combinations times the creep factor, it's usually a matter of cracking. I use the Service Design - ECR plots to gauge the amount of predicted cracking, and in your model at many of the supports, the cracking results in approximately double curvature, over 50% cracked."

    How exactly do I check the predicted cracking? How do I use the Service Design-ECR plots?
  • Go to Layers - Rule Set Design - Service Design and make a new plan (or change what's plotted on any plot already there).
    Choose Section Analysis - Active (check box) and ECR (effective curvature ratio) values. You should typically see flat plots where there is no cracking. The magnitude will then match the user input creep fact (3.35 in the example above). Where the values spike at high moment demand locations you'll see larger numbers. A number over 7 is an indication of high cracking, over 50% cracked (7 > 2 * 3.35). You can also set the creep factor to 1.0 and review the same plot if it's easier, just be sure to reset the creep factor to something reasonable before performing load history analysis.
    Keep in mind, the spikes indicate sections where cracking is prevalent. If some sections are cracked and others are not then you can't just estimate that the long term deflection = ECR * first order defection, but if the cracking is similar at both ends that's only a slightly conservative estimate. For more on Load History analysis, check this wiki: communities.bentley.com/.../6191