Using Geopak SS3 .722, I'm finding that when I have certain tools activated and I try to change Civil AccuDraw origin, Civil AccuDraw behaves strangely. I'll give a couple specific examples:
I realize that this behavior may not affect most users because they're not going to be as ridiculous as I am at investigating how things work, and since I know these things now I will easily be able to work around it. (That doesn't mitigate the annoyance.)
It's clear that Civil AccuDraw's origin setting tool is somehow dependent on what the active tool can accept, and my hunch is that this is not working as designed, and indeed is irregular and (in my opinion) should be fixed.
The workflow I was doing when I discovered this strange behavior is that I was measuring areas and needed to know the station at the beginning and end of the area.
(EDIT: I mention this step of the workflow only for context: that is the task I was working on, not to suggest that I expected to find the areas using Civil AccuDraw. Other edits are to clarify that for each case I mention above, I had that tool selected as I was attempting to set the Civil AccuDraw origin.)
Robert GarrettSenior Product EngineerBentley Systems Inc.
Unknown said:In the examples you listed, Civil Accudraw is not even in play because it is not relevant to the described tasks. Civil Accudraw does ONLY one thing. It feeds point information to other commands.
This response boggles the mind. Yes, you're right: CA does only one thing. It feeds point information to other commands. But I'm not talking about what CA reports as much as I'm talking about how you set the origin baseline. In my view, however, it shouldn't matter what tool I'm working with. When setting the origin, I should be able to select any element that could be selected if any other tool had been selected. The selection of the CA baseline should be 100% independent of any tool that you're currently working with.
Allow me to present my workflow more concisely:
Try these steps on any file and I'm confident you'll see the same. I don't believe this workflow is especially out of the ordinary. In fact, I go through similar steps all the time when I'm at quantities stage.
Unknown said:Perhaps you should send a video clip. Civil Accudraw will not even be active when Measure Area by Element is active.
The HUD won't be rendered, sure, but it does work if you use the hard display. (And by the way, I think this is a very important drawback to the HUD: this is just one reason that a user might need station and offset coordinates when not actively constructing new linework. Hence, I have little interest in the HUD and would rather have a setting available that would either disable it altogether or have it so that as soon as I open CA, the hard window comes up.)
A couple notes but you may need to schedule some time with one of our support team to walk thru the process. Or you can contact me directly Robert.Garrett@bentley.com.
I see the goal you want to reach, but the measure area command would not accomplish what you want with or without CA. You could draw in some construction elements of course and thus make a new area for a shape or flood fill but the wiring for Civil Accudraw to feed start and stop is just not there. At the risk of beating a dead horse, Civil Accudraw (also Microstation Accudraw) feed points to other commands. XY, DXDY, StationOffset, Distance-Distance are all point functions thus when a command needs an area or volume there is no role for Accudraw to play.
Unknown said:the measure area command would not accomplish what you want with or without CA.
I'm hopelessly confused at this remark, and I'm quite sure my thoughts aren't coming through, but I don't know how to express myself any other way.
Yes, I get that Measure Area itself would not get me all the answers I'm looking for in one click. I'm not trying to do that. As cool as that would be, I was never expecting that result. However, in case that was ever going to be implemented, it could be presented as a report just like the alignment reports.
In the interest of being more clear about my position, let's take a couple steps back, here. (And feel free to let me know how I should have started this thread to have been more clear from the get-go.)
At the end of the video you can see that I got what I needed: the begin station for the area I measured. The steps I took was always how I expected to get the station. (I never expected to get it from Measure Area.) I always knew I needed to open CA and then set the baseline for CA, but I remembered too late to notice that it hadn't been set since I opened the file and started measuring areas. That means I was already using a tool that would accept only area elements.
Now, to remedy the problem where CA had no baseline for my S-O coordinates, I clicked to set the origin. I expected that the next input should be able to receive a linear element. Because, you know, I was trying to set the baseline alignment for CA. Instead, I had to select a different tool before I could set the baseline. And then, of course, after setting the baseline I had to go back to the Measure Area tool.
My whole point here is that the tool that is active (and what elements are eligible for that tool's input) should have exactly no influence on what CA will accept as its origin baseline. This was always my primary point in this thread.
A secondary point was that when using various measure tools, the baseline that is finally received by CA is strange.
EDIT: I find that in addition to the various measure tools, when using Modify Element, I can't set the baseline for CA.
So...are there any plans to modify the behavior of CA to permit it to select *any* valid element that CA could select, no matter what tool is selected? Could this functionality be listed as a request for future enhancement?
Say I'm editing a text element, and I've already written quite a bit. I realize I need a station along an alignment.
Civil Accudraw is reporting station and offset on one baseline but I need the station and offset from a different baseline. I click the button to set a new origin baseline. I move the cursor over the alignment I want to use. It won't accept it. It says "Element not valid for tool" in the tooltip.
I'd rather not click in space to commit the changes, because there's a lot of text in the text element I was working in, and when I do finally have the station and offset, I have to relocate where I need to enter the text. (Yes, there are clever solutions to make this easier. I shouldn't need a clever solution to avoid this issue that is so obviously a bug.) But it looks like I have to. So I click in space to commit the changes to the text element's contents.
I click to set the origin. I attempt the same thing. Same issue. So obviously it's a tool thing.
So now I have to do the selection tool, or a line-drawing tool, or some other tool (I don't have a complete list of what works and what doesn't). Then I click to set the origin, then click the very same alignment that I'd tried to click before. It works fine.
And now I have to go back to the text edit tool, find where I was editing before, and then snap to whatever I need the address for.
Civil Accudraw should be tool agnostic. So can this be listed as a bug?