[OpenRoads SS3] Civil AccuDraw set origin

I think what you are seeing is a misinterpretation of either the function of Civil Accudraw or the feedback from the commands.

In the examples you listed, Civil Accudraw is not even in play because it is not relevant to the described tasks. Civil Accudraw does ONLY one thing. It feeds point information to other commands.

So, when you measure area using the points method the measure area command needs a series of points which CA can feed. Likewise the flood method needs a point which CA can feed. But the other methods of measure area are picking elements not feeding points. If, CA was running in floating dialog mode then you would never even see it because no points are being prompted. I assume you must be in fixed dialog mode or triggered the origin input from the CA toolbox

So, is CA dependent on what the tool can accept? Yes. It is only used when the tool is needing a point input.

Unknown said:

In the examples you listed, Civil Accudraw is not even in play because it is not relevant to the described tasks. Civil Accudraw does ONLY one thing. It feeds point information to other commands.

This response boggles the mind. Yes, you're right: CA does only one thing. It feeds point information to other commands. But I'm not talking about what CA reports as much as I'm talking about how you set the origin baseline. In my view, however, it shouldn't matter what tool I'm working with. When setting the origin, I should be able to select any element that could be selected if any other tool had been selected. The selection of the CA baseline should be 100% independent of any tool that you're currently working with. 

Allow me to present my workflow more concisely:

1. The next task I was set to do is to measure areas for estimated quantities, so I selected the Measure Area tool.
2. After measuring one of several areas, I realized that I needed the station at the beginning of the area and at the end of the area, so I opened Civil AccuDraw, and since the baseline hadn't been selected already.
3. I clicked to set the origin, and I attempted to select the appropriate chain. When I clicked it, it gave me some bogus information that wasn't going to be useful.
4. At this point it became clear to me that I could (would have to) switch to the Selection tool or many other tools and set the origin baseline.

Try these steps on any file and I'm confident you'll see the same. I don't believe this workflow is especially out of the ordinary. In fact, I go through similar steps all the time when I'm at quantities stage.

So...are there any plans to modify the behavior of CA to permit it to select *any* valid element that CA could select, no matter what tool is selected? Could this functionality be listed as a request for future enhancement?

Scenario:

Say I'm editing a text element, and I've already written quite a bit. I realize I need a station along an alignment. 

Civil Accudraw is reporting station and offset on one baseline but I need the station and offset from a different baseline. I click the button to set a new origin baseline. I move the cursor over the alignment I want to use. It won't accept it. It says "Element not valid for tool" in the tooltip. 

I'd rather not click in space to commit the changes, because there's a lot of text in the text element I was working in, and when I do finally have the station and offset, I have to relocate where I need to enter the text. (Yes, there are clever solutions to make this easier. I shouldn't need a clever solution to avoid this issue that is so obviously a bug.) But it looks like I have to. So I click in space to commit the changes to the text element's contents.

I click to set the origin. I attempt the same thing. Same issue. So obviously it's a tool thing. 

So now I have to do the selection tool, or a line-drawing tool, or some other tool (I don't have a complete list of what works and what doesn't). Then I click to set the origin, then click the very same alignment that I'd tried to click before. It works fine. 

And now I have to go back to the text edit tool, find where I was editing before, and then snap to whatever I need the address for.

Civil Accudraw should be tool agnostic. So can this be listed as a bug?

Pulling this back up from the depths because it has come up again.

Civil Accudraw should be tool agnostic. So can this be listed as a bug?

Bump for futility.

Derek:  You really should re-read this entire thread.  You are asking for Civil Accudraw to do something for which it was never designed and to which there is not even a relationship.  Civil Accudraw does one and only one thing.  It feeds points to other commands which need a point.  It is completely and absolutely agnostic to which tool is being used. But, it is designed ONLY as an input tool, not a tracking tool. (although in some circumstances there are some tracking side effects)

However, the tools in question must be such as requiring point input.  The measure area command using element method which you describe does not function based on any point, thus Civil Accudraw is inactive/Asleep.  It will never become active until some other command is started which needs point input.  You are wanting to use CA as a reporting tool, which is fine but it is not a continuously active since no point is being asked for.

So, I suggest the following:

1. Upgrade to latest versions:  All the reporting tools that you need for reporting areas are there.  Parcel report will provide the area as well as station and offset of points.  And as was previously noted, the inverse points report might also be useful.  The parcel report should exist even in SS3 and will give you a million times better results than the Microstation area command.  If you are using SS2, then CA really only exists there as a teaser for later versions.  It is not very useful at all.
2. If you are wanting Civil Accudraw to become a tool providing continuous feedback of the cursor position (a tracking tool), then you should file the following request with Bentley.  "I want Civil Accudraw to be enhanced to have an option for providing continuous tracking feedback on the cursor position even when I am using a tool which does not require point input."  I have no idea if this will get any traction with the development team but at least the request will be out there for others to perhaps co-sponsor.
3. It is very important when posting these questions to drill down to the heart of the need or problem.  (I know, sometimes this is difficult to figure out). For this specifically described issue your real need was: "I need an area report which also includes station and offset of some of the points"  This is doable.  See number 1.  

Unknown said:

 "I want Civil Accudraw to be enhanced to have an option for providing continuous tracking feedback on the cursor position even when I am using a tool which does not require point input."

This is redundant. Civil Accudraw already does provide continuous tracking feedback on the cursor position even when I am using a tool which does not require point input. Assuming, of course, I am not on a tentative snap.

Unknown said:

It is very important when posting these questions to drill down to the heart of the need or problem.  (I know, sometimes this is difficult to figure out). For this specifically described issue your real need was: "I need an area report which also includes station and offset of some of the points"  This is doable.  See number 1.

Indeed, I have. It's in the programming. 

When I am on a tool such as selection, I can set the origin for CA just fine. When I am on a tool such as measure area, everything I see suggests that I can set the origin for CA, but when I do so, all stationing and offsets are either entirely fictitious or are derived from an element other than my intended baseline.

Unknown said:

Upgrade to latest versions:  All the reporting tools that you need for reporting areas are there.  Parcel report will provide the area as well as station and offset of points.

I have been using SS4 .878 for quite some time. Parcel Report may solve one situation in which the CR would solve, but here's another:

I want to be able to edit a text box once while being able to switch between alignments. For example, I want the station and offset from one baseline and the station and offset from another at the same exact point. I want to enter the text in one single text box just once. I could have done this with Geopak's good old Active Chain Control.

There is no reason whatsoever that OpenRoads should require a certain tool or certain set of tools to be active prior to being able to set the origin baseline. None.

Unknown said:

 "I want Civil Accudraw to be enhanced to have an option for providing continuous tracking feedback on the cursor position even when I am using a tool which does not require point input."

This is redundant. Civil Accudraw already does provide continuous tracking feedback on the cursor position even when I am using a tool which does not require point input. Assuming, of course, I am not on a tentative snap.

Unknown said:

It is very important when posting these questions to drill down to the heart of the need or problem.  (I know, sometimes this is difficult to figure out). For this specifically described issue your real need was: "I need an area report which also includes station and offset of some of the points"  This is doable.  See number 1.

Indeed, I have. It's in the programming. 

When I am on a tool such as selection, I can set the origin for CA just fine. When I am on a tool such as measure area, everything I see suggests that I can set the origin for CA, but when I do so, all stationing and offsets are either entirely fictitious or are derived from an element other than my intended baseline.

Unknown said:

Upgrade to latest versions:  All the reporting tools that you need for reporting areas are there.  Parcel report will provide the area as well as station and offset of points.

I have been using SS4 .878 for quite some time. Parcel Report may solve one situation in which the CR would solve, but here's another:

I want to be able to edit a text box once while being able to switch between alignments. For example, I want the station and offset from one baseline and the station and offset from another at the same exact point. I want to enter the text in one single text box just once. I could have done this with Geopak's good old Active Chain Control.

There is no reason whatsoever that OpenRoads should require a certain tool or certain set of tools to be active prior to being able to set the origin baseline. None.