OpenRoads Designer
When creating sheets from named boundaries the software automatically creates a drawing model then a sheet model from the named boundary. This workflow seems to work well and is pretty straight forward. The problem I have ran into is the fact the drawing model references are rotated and sometimes moved. So the world coordinates in the drawing model don't match the design model. If I where to identify a coordinate value or bearing without using the "OpenRoads label tools" they would be incorrect. Where do we label or annotate world coordinates and bearings? I would prefer to do it in the drawing model. Is there a setting or workflow to keep the drawing model references scale 1:1 , xy=0,0 and rotation 0 degrees?
Hi Zane,
All annotation should be done within the Drawing Model. Are you wanting to annotate civil elements with their coordinates? You will have to create a Text Favorite for this, then add it to an annotation group. Here's an example video of how to do this: https://communities.bentley.com/products/road___site_design/w/road_and_site_design__wiki/34981/video-editing-the-station-format-of-a-horizontal-alignment-s-annotation
Holly
For more information about the Road and Site design tools, visit the Road and Site design WIKI at: http://communities.bentley.com/products/road___site_design/w/road_and_site_design__wiki
My concern is that the references in the drawing model are moved and rotated, so the coordinates are incorrect. This is very scary. I can only annotate coordinates and bearings with text favorites? How do a verify the coordinates and bearings from the text favorites are correct?
The annotation comes from properties from the design model. The Drawing model has the design model referenced to it. So when annotation occurs, it takes the information from the design model. You can verify that they are correct by annotating in the drawing model, then checking to make sure the coordinates match when you snap to the point within the design model.
After watching videos etc.. I expected the drawing models to be 1:1 and not moved or rotated. This would allow for normal annotation and sheet production techniques to be used. I would definitely recommend Bentley look at changing the drawing model workflow. Once people start using the software and realize the drawing models have incorrect coordinate values associated to them, they will be concerned.
FYI,
Civil projects rely heavily on coordinate data x,y,z. Many Microstation users may not know how to create text favorites or annotation groups etc... also, they may not have the admin rights to do so. Users rely on the coordinate data in drawings to annotate the sheets. With the references in the drawing model rotated or moved I am concerned this will create problems, giving users incorrect coordinate or bearing values.
Every designer, cad operator, drafter would expect Drawing Model to be design model 1:1 with the original coordinate system. This is natural workflow. And I believe it was advised by Bentley since Drawing models were introduced.
We annotate not only civil geometry, and not only civil objects are put on drawings. Usually, we have topo survey there, other discipline drawings coming from different cad platforms.What if I want to annotate XYZ of a corner of existing retaining wall drawn with AutoCad? What tool would I use to annotate XYZ od such non-civil element in a drawing model?
I've just started with drawing production tools in ORD, and if this is true that drawing model are not in correct coordinates and we can only use text fav to annotate correctly, ... I would be really concerned. Will investigate this deeper and post an update here soon.
I fully agree with Zane, Civil Projects rely on XYZ, and believe me OpneRoads models with its geometry and capabilities are only a portion of designs we develop, just a single discipline. We have other stuff in our drawings, not only the OpenRoads Elements, we have full context: existing topo, other proposed infrastructure elements, etc.
We always attach design models to drawings models with no rotation, scale change or movement - coincident method (in most cases drawings are stored in other files than dgn with design model), we annotate elements depending on scale and purpose of the drawing. Then we create sheets. We keep original coordinates as long as possible.
Text favorites are not the cure for everything:
-technology seems to be not fully matured (how to manage, group, update or share text fav??? I just started with annotation tools and my list of text fav is pretty long, and the list window is very small..)
-can not use the same text fav for OpenRoads and Not Openroads elements, eg, XYZ in Plan, or STA EL in profile (sometimes we dont even annotate exact element, just need XYZ or STA annotated just in not-populated area, like approx. valuie)
-when annotation need to be changed, eg station format, accuracy - I noticed we can use []active setting for some OpenRoad related text favs, but for some reason it does not work for me
Adam,
Thanks for the reply. The more I use OpenRoads Designer the more I am concerned about this issue. I have worked on many large scale projects, including Mines, Landfills, and Energy facilities that were designed using InRoads and Microstation/Autocad. These projects rely primarily on xyz data. Alignments, corridors, terrains etc... may not even be associated to many of the civil drawings. So being able to annotate the native xyz and bearing data is critical to drawing production. Also, on these projects non civil drafters/designers are using the civil drawings. In my opinion anyone should be able to get into a civil drawing and snap to an element and pull the correct xy or xyz data. Creating a drawing model that moves and rotates the reference files is confusing and could even be a liability for engineers.