OpenRoads Designer
When creating sheets from named boundaries the software automatically creates a drawing model then a sheet model from the named boundary. This workflow seems to work well and is pretty straight forward. The problem I have ran into is the fact the drawing model references are rotated and sometimes moved. So the world coordinates in the drawing model don't match the design model. If I where to identify a coordinate value or bearing without using the "OpenRoads label tools" they would be incorrect. Where do we label or annotate world coordinates and bearings? I would prefer to do it in the drawing model. Is there a setting or workflow to keep the drawing model references scale 1:1 , xy=0,0 and rotation 0 degrees?
when were labeling with plan labeler in ORD I can not place the text at different angles. the text is always horizontal 0 or 360. is there a way to place the text at different angles like the GeoPak Labeler?
Garry
What I have found by testing ORD the last few weeks is that you can only annotate with "labels" in the drawing model. (Unless you want your text rotated true north 100% of the time) . The labels don't seem to rotate with the active view. If the drawing model is created from a named boundary the software rotates the reference files instead of the view , which is a totally new workflow and different from what we are use to. This workflow raises a question I have been trying to address in this post. How do you verify coordinates and bearings from rotated and moved reference files. I assume you just have to trust that the label tool is working correctly and pulling the correct data.
The cardinal sin in Civil design/drafting is moving and rotating georeferenced (plan view) reference files. This applies to AutoCAD and Microstation. I understand the drawing model workflow and I am all for it. We just need a drawing model with a rotated view at scale 1:1 and 0 rotation.
Zane Pratt said:he cardinal sin in Civil design/drafting is moving and rotating georeferenced (plan view) reference files. This applies to AutoCAD and Microstation. I understand the drawing model workflow and I am all for it. We just need a drawing model with a rotated view at scale 1:1 and 0 rotation.
I fully agree - drawing model mus by 1:1 with design model and cut into sheets later on. Moreover I don't like this clipped drawings, when annotating I would like to have a full picture, along with further sheet border. But it is cruicial to annotate model that is 1:1 with design, no rotation or scale factor applied, so we can verify coordinates with all microstation commands (even with snap and running coordinates), not just text favorites or labels. we have non-civil elements to be annotated, other disciplines referenced, etc. I don't believe current approach can be used in real world project successfully.
would be great to know what is the Bentley development plan for this drawing production.
I don't know if there is any reason to prevent using unrotated drawing model. Let development team answer.
Meanwhile a workaround to keep your workflow, I fully understand and agree with, is to create your own drawing model in which you can reference your design unrotated. Then you reference back this model in the design with no nesting. Now you can produce sheets with no action in the individual drawing models.
So one more model and reference management but you have to do it only once or have it already prepared in a seed.
Jpin, Thanks for the input. The problem we are finding is that you can't annotate an unrotated drawing model with labels. The labels don't rotate to match the view rotation. Not sure I understand the workaround you mentioned in your post. May need to explain in more detail.
Bentley's workflow for creating sheets from drawing models has been around awhile, I set it up in SS2 and SS4. The only thing new is the use of named boundaries instead of saved views. Creating a drawing model from a named boundary or saved view makes sense. You can isolate the view, clip the references and annotate the individual drawings that can be combined to make a sheet. This is how the Uniform Drawing System (UDS) is set up in National CAD Standards documentation. This is great to see. The problem I am finding with the drawing model workflow is the fact that the software creates a drawing model from a named boundary then rotates the reference files instead of the view for annotation. That may be ok for architectural drawings were coordinates don't really matter, but for civil drawings coordinates are everything. A mislabeled coordinate on a project can cost an engineer or DOT thousands of dollars.
I don't see Bentley changing this soon. I would guess the workflow for creating sheets from named boundaries (saved views) is difficult to change and effects many different products. I believe Bentley is trying to standardize how sheet creation is accomplished in Microstation and this is a good thing. Out of all the DOT's in the US that use Microstation, I would bet almost every one has a different method for creating sheets. As users we just want something standard and simple to understand like Autocad's paperspace and modelspace.
I think our best bet would be to push for "Labels" to have the ability to rotate with the active view as dimensions and text do. This at least would allow users to annotate coordinates, bearings etc... in a design model at the true location.
jpln,
I was trying to reproduce the workflow you describe in your post. Do you use the named boundary dialog to produce sheets? Do you create sheets references from the design model or the drawing model? Are you annotating data in the drawing model or design model?
As you can tell this rotated drawing model issue is really bugging me :-)
It doesn’t matter what view, model, drawing, design. One cannot place the text with this tool and make the angle of the text different than 0 or 360. In GeoPak labeler you can place labels text and different angles than o or 360.