Existing Serpentine Driveway/Sidewalk in Cross-section

The key this (and other similar) questions is to remind ourselves that we are making models now with cross-sections as by product. Back in the day, for GEOPAK users, we designed cross-sections and the model was a by-product, assuming you had sufficient patience and need to develop a model from cross-sections.

So, the answer is: This particular driveway needs to be modeled just like a side road.  In my opinion, ALL driveways should be treated as side roads and actually modeled rather than trying to trick something into the cross-sections.  One or two bullet proof civil cells will be key to efficiency. Then the process is:

1. Alignment for the driveway (this is new for some designers)
2. Proposed profile for the driveway (this is also new for some)
3. Drop a civil cell on the alignments.

Yes, I know, this is potentially a LOT of alignments.  Not a big deal here in TN since driveway alignments and profiles must be labeled on plans anyway. But for some of you on some projects this is potentially multiple hundreds of alignments which you have never needed before.  

How long does it take for the above workflow? Assuming you have a good civil cell, it takes me about 10 minutes per driveway. On a large urban project, it takes a week or so just for driveways. 

What's the up side?:

• Your model is more complete.
• Placement of side drains and associated head walls are exact rather than approximations.
• Various volumes related to the driveway are much easier since they are reportable from the model.

I have heard various rumblings from various people that suggest a civil cell for driveways should be possible which does not require the alignment and profile. However, I have never seen one which actually works and I would be very surprised if current civil cell technology is robust enough to make the necessary decisions.    

Thanks, that is the direction I was expecting to take.

There is another option, but it can be time consuming. Create a bunch of terrain elements using the 3D elements that represent sidewalk edges as breaklines. In some cases, they can be boundary types, to prevent stray triangle edges. Then apply a surface template representing the existing sidewalk distance. Repeat for driveways/parking lots. Then when sections are cut, the surface templates will show as existing thickness. I cannot take credit for this - a long time GEOPAK user who worked with us on our Ss4 workspace came up with this technique. We have a small set of element templates that are defined for use with the surface templates, so we get dashed lines for any existing pavement and solid for proposed. 

Thanks, I tried this and it works for my needs.

This is the method I have been using as well.  Agreed... It may take longer then using a Civil Cell but I get the exact result I desire and at this result is more important to me than speed.   

Tom Cox IDOT District 6 Cadd / GIS Manager

So the civil cell I mentioned is just what you have done.  I don't use a civil cell from the ORD installation, I make my own.  Not that I don't trust anyone else but...well...actually, that is the case.  I don't trust anyone else. :-)  

You don't need to muck about in DGNLIB files or anything, just make it right in your project.  Using the first driveway, design it long hand as per the steps Chuck describes. Then make a civil cell from this first driveway and plop it onto all the rest of the driveways. 

Thanks Robert.  I didn't use a Civil Cell though.  I simply profiled all the lines of the PCC portion of the entrance,  then created a terrain of the PCC, then applied a surface template to the terrain, then applied a linear template to each side of the entrance.  As you know though, I am fairly new to ORD.  I haven't tried creating any Civil Cells yet. 

I have been using the same method for ADA ramps and have been very happy with the results.  See attached.

For the existing entrance, I created a Clipped Terrain of the existing PCC.  I then applied a surface template to it to show the thickness.

Tom Cox IDOT District 6 Cadd / GIS Manager

Thanks Robert.  I didn't use a Civil Cell though.  I simply profiled all the lines of the PCC portion of the entrance,  then created a terrain of the PCC, then applied a surface template to the terrain, then applied a linear template to each side of the entrance.  As you know though, I am fairly new to ORD.  I haven't tried creating any Civil Cells yet. 

I have been using the same method for ADA ramps and have been very happy with the results.  See attached.

For the existing entrance, I created a Clipped Terrain of the existing PCC.  I then applied a surface template to it to show the thickness.

Tom Cox IDOT District 6 Cadd / GIS Manager