[IR SS2] Vertical alignment or corridor with gaps?

Not sure if this is possible...

I am working on a shared use path, and I've been asked to design a single vertical alignment with "gaps" in it (to signify roadway crossings and other elements where we do not need a profile). Whether this is accomplished by an actual gap, or by outlandish elevations (used to do this with Geopak) - I don't know how best to go about this. I'd prefer something where I do not have to go through and delete unwanted sections of my profile every single time I need to visualize it.

And in similar vein, is there any way to make a gap in between template drops? Like: template, template, no template, template, template? That would be a whole lot easier than making (and keeping track of) a dozen separate corridors, and easier even that coming up with a "nothing" template (in case the transitions refuse to behave).

Thank you.
MaryB
Power InRoads 08.11.07.615

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  • Mary, I don't know why you can't Drop templates Sta to Sta. With no transitions it should leaves the gaps you want,

    Idaho Red

  • InRoads will not allow a section with no template.  It will always connect features and triangulate between templates.  Transitions, whether or not they are present, won't change that.

    I've always found it easier to create a "nothing" template, with two features, to span the breaks then come back and delete the triangles in those locations.  Don't rely on transitions to model these sections.  Instead drop the normal template just before the gap, then drop the "nothing" template 0.01 or 0.001 after.  The spacing for the "nothing" template drop should be greater than the length of the gap.  Then do the reverse at the other end of the gap.  When I've completed my design work I'll create interior boundaries at each of those gaps; it's more work than simply deleting the triangles but it's usually a heck of a lot less work than cleaning up the exterior boundary.

    I've never tried modeling with gaps in the primary vertical alignment but I suspect that any template drops that fall in those gaps will be placed at elevation 0.

    If it's important that the ends of the gaps look correct when visualizing the model, you will have to do some extra work.  This is true whether you use transitions, "nothing" templates or multiple corridors.  It's also true whether you create your visualization with surfaces or components.  This is because exterior boundaries go from the end of one template to the end of the next.  When you have abrupt changes in templates - such as these gaps or the start or end of a sidewalk or the end of a corridor - the exterior boundary will not include the intermediate points that have been dropped and you will end up with a bunch of very thin triangles that you will need to delete.

    For most quick visualizations - for verifying modeling and reviewing project impacts - no extra work is needed beyond the inclusion of the "nothing" templates.  Beyond that, the level of work required will depend on the level of refinement you're looking for in your visualization.

    Answer Verified By: MaryB 

  • Interesting.  I'll have to play around with that.  Is there also a gap in the top mesh?

    One of the distinctions between modeling with Roadway Designer (SS2 and prior) and OpenRoads technology (since SS3) is the primary product.  With Roadway Designer it is one or more surfaces.  With OpenRoads it is one or more components.  A surface in the earlier product requires a closed boundary (or a lot of extra triangles).  Components don't need boundaries.  With SS2 you can include a truly empty template but you still end up with triangles across the gap.  There will not be any components across the gap.

    So, Mary, give an empty template (no points at all) and see how that works.  I recall trying that in the past and it not working but that may have been an earlier version.  You'll still have to delete triangles but an empty template would be cleaner, in my estimation, than the "nothing" template I suggested earlier.

  • By "drop sections" do you mean cut cross sections?

    I wouldn't need all of those sections for my plan set. Matter of fact, it would be preferred if I DIDN'T include all those sections in my plan set. Is there a way to move cross sections I need for design but do not need on my plan sheets off of the sheets in a way that design will still recognize them? I've moved cross sections around before, but the design doesn't always recognize them after that. I'd prefer to be able to make one run of sections and just move the ones I want off to the side, as opposed to trying to maintain one set of "design" sections and another set of "sheet" sections.

    MaryB

    Power GeoPak 08.11.09.918
    Power InRoads 08.11.09.918
    OpenRoads Designer 2021 R2

        

  • Yes, cut cross sections is probably a better way to say it.

    I don't think there is a way to display them somewhere else and maintain the integrity of the set for design and analysis purposes.  I suppose you could change those section graphics to construction class and not print construction class elements but that would result in some odd gaps in you printed sets.  Aside from that, I think you're stuck with either including those sections in your plan sheets or maintaining two sets of cross sections.  Hopefully, someone else has a better answer than that.

  • The frustrating part is that sometimes I can move them, and they WILL stay recognized (as "proved" by a run through the Cross Section Viewer). It makes me wonder if there's some type of non-graphic data written somewhere on/in/near the section. Sometiems I manage to grab it, sometimes I don't.

    I don't know...

    MaryB

    Power GeoPak 08.11.09.918
    Power InRoads 08.11.09.918
    OpenRoads Designer 2021 R2

        

  • There is, but I'm not sure where it is.  As I understand it there is a text node at the lower left corner of the set.  It's part of a graphic group with the set so if graphic group lock is on and text nodes are displayed you should be able to move the set and maintain its integrity.  Of course, all of that is for the set and you want to move individual sections.  I suspect there is something similar attached to each section but I don't know what or where.

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  • There is, but I'm not sure where it is.  As I understand it there is a text node at the lower left corner of the set.  It's part of a graphic group with the set so if graphic group lock is on and text nodes are displayed you should be able to move the set and maintain its integrity.  Of course, all of that is for the set and you want to move individual sections.  I suspect there is something similar attached to each section but I don't know what or where.

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