Vertical geometry modification in ORD.

Is there a way to break vertical complex geometry line that has been created from surface into a single elements (lines and curves preferably not ruled)?

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  • Hi Simon,

    Thanks for the respond.

    This what I am trying to do:

    1. I create horizontal alignment and I make it a complex element.
    2. I open profile view of that horizontal alignment where I have a line representing my terrain model.
    3. I use “Define Profile by best fit” option for the design of my vertical alignment. Because I want to keep my profile as close as possible to the terrain, but I also want to fix geometry of my alignment as much as I can, I set my envelope to be very small from 0 – 0.05m and I give my preferred K values and I set my curve length to be 5m.
    4. When the profile is created, in some sections (where my existing road is quite bad) I am getting one grade followed by another grade.
    5. I would like to be able to explode this profile, delete two grades and manually redesign this section the way I like it.
    6. I tried “Complex redefine” option and sometimes I got it to work, but sometimes the software remembers the rules between the elements and this option doesn’t work. I have a filling that everything I do in the design process, gets remembered by the software and get ruled, that if I change my mind and want to delete a section of profile... it just can't be done... because it is ruled to something that is ruled to something that is ruled to something.....etc.
    7. I was trying everything, “Simplify Geometry”, “Intervals”, “Remove Rules” even trying to use Microstation lines and curves to replace the part of alignment that I wanted, and sometimes it works, sometimes doesn’t. Just can’t get my head around it, why sometimes works, and sometimes doesn’t. I must be missing some “small” things that are probably important for this process.

    There must be a way of doing this, I am pretty sure about that…it’s just that I don’t know how. These rules between the elements can be VERY annoying if you don’t understand how they work.

    I wish that I can turn ruling of elements off and that I can create a complex line (horizontal or vertical) without any rules between elements.

    I was trying also to figure out how the rules between the elements are created and connected between each other, but when I go to properties (or explorer) of a complex element I get lost because when I start expanding the tree for Complex element, the tree just gets bigger and bigger. I have difficulties to figure out what is going on …what depends on what? 

    Sometimes when I want to delete an element, the software doesn’t let me to do it. I am sure the reason for that is because this element is ruled to something and that rule is preventing me to delete this element, but I have no idea how to figure out what rule to what element is preventing me to do this.

    I think I need to get a better understating of "ruling" to get over this problem.

    I appreciate your help on this matter.

    Regards,

    Bratislav

  • A workaround I found when I could not "unrule" part of a Profile so I could get the modifications I needed, was to export to LandXML and reimport. The imported Profile is reduces to simple rules with no "relies on" rules and is then easy to edit. 


    Charles (Chuck) Rheault
    CADD Manager

    MDOT State Highway Administration

    • MicroStation user since IGDS, InRoads user since TDP.
    • AutoCAD, Land Desktop and Civil 3D, off and on since 1996
  • The workflow that I have used for this is:

    1. Use "Profile From Surface" to create initial profile, usually at some negative vertical offset, but that's not necessary.
    2. Select profile and select "Create Best Fit Profile" to create new profile.
    3. Select new profile and select "Convert to Profile Rule".  This profile can now be edited and the original profile deleted.

    I use this workflow when I want a profile developed from the surface (usually for utilities) but I need to make edits to remove "glitches" derived from spikes in the terrain model.  See screen shot below.  Hope this helps.

    (Hat tip to Mark Ditko)

    Karl Dauber, PE
    Advance Consulting
    Laurens County, SC
    karldauber@advconsult.net
    www.advconsult.net
    www.linkedin.com/in/karldauber

  • Thanks Karl. I'll try this workflow.

    Regards,

    Bratislav

  • Thanks Charles. I'll try this workaround.

    Regards,

    Bratislav